The Joe Rogan Conundrum: For Independent Artists, What's the Cost of Quitting Spotify?

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In service of brevity, we'll refer to the dilemma facing emergent artists dealing with doubts about the politics and finances of Spotify and streaming music in early 2022 as "The Joe Rogan Conundrum."

On the matter of whether to unplug their music from the digital service, it's often a question of whether a personal stance is strong enough to outweigh the benefits of visibility and accessibility for potential fans all over the world.

For jazz and rockabilly singer Jolie Goodnight, the question doesn't revolve so much around the fractions of pennies she earns from streams on the giant music streaming platform. Instead, it's about whether her disagreement with the views of the popular podcaster are strong enough to push her to walk away from a major resource to help build new fans.

"At the end of the day, my No. 1 priority is taking care of my fans and reaching new fans and being there for my audience," said Goodnight, who fronts her own jazz band and the rockabilly act Jolie & the Jackalopes. "Does it make sense for me to stand and be firm in what I believe in? My process right now is about what is going to hurt versus what is going to help, and what is jumping on a bandwagon versus standing for what you believe in?

"I also don't like the idea of a platform like Spotify becoming a place with only a certain kind of voice. I would rather my voice be accessible wherever it is needed."

Welcome to life as an independent musician in the streaming age. The ideological self-test that was spawned in January when classic rocker Neil Young – and a parade of his peers – opted to pull their catalogs from Spotify because of its support of controversial podcaster Rogan has offered up a look-in-the-mirror moment for younger musicians, many of whom already see the streaming music service as a must-have to be seen as a legitimate artist.

Artists and managers interviewed about the Rogan Conundrum told the Chronicle that the questions they face revolve more around how all streaming services fit into the puzzle of building a career in a world where touring is still an uncertainty and physical album sales have largely dried up.

Louie Carr, manager for Austin blues artist Jackie Venson, said he has lowered the effort put into Spotify promotion in recent years, in part because attempts to gain spots on playlists on the service led to frustration. Carr recalled the waste of spending $6,000 on a campaign with a playlist promoter while working on Venson's 2019 album, Joy, calling the playlist game a playground for predators and snake oil salesmen.

Carr and Venson still see Spotify as a necessary resource that helps strengthen the bond built with fans on other social media platforms.

"Don't worry about tapping your moral compass and worry about if you're doing the right thing trying to keep your 20,000 or 10,000 listeners happy. It's not as much of a moral quandary for us down here since we're out here trying to survive in the most tumultuous time in the history of the music industry. In this time when everything is difficult, Spotify does also add some revenue."

As to the decision by Young and other legacy artists to depart Spotify and earn prominence on competing platforms in the process, Carr sees that as a question of haves and have-nots.

"That's their privilege but it's not ours. Good for them and I appreciate the stand, but we didn't change the sound of a generation and sell millions of albums. They have the privilege of financial security while we spend three fourths of every dollar we make to create and keep ourselves alive."

Kevin Wommack, a veteran artist manager and music publisher who helped launch the career of Texas rockers Los Lonely Boys, said none of the two dozen artists in his Traffic Music Group stable have explored pulling their music from Spotify, which is a reliable source of revenue for most of his clients.

"We've gotten calls from people wanting to know what Los Lonely Boys are going to do, or wondering if this person or another is going to take a stance ... We work for the artist so if they wanted to have their things pulled we would go through all of them and ask if they're going to be altruistic with where they're at in their career, and do you need that $1,000 that's going to be coming in this month or is that money worth it to you to make a stand?"

Wommack said the awareness offered to artists who earn spots on high-visibility playlists on Spotify can play an important role in furthering their careers, with the Texas Gentlemen among his acts who are currently featured prominently on the platform.

Even with the potential benefits offered by streaming services, Wommack said he hopes the attention brought by Young's stance will lead to a larger debate about how Spotify and others compensate artists in general.

"The focus needs to be not on what a local artist should do there and whether they're going to get on the so-called cool bus, but what is the right thing for Spotify to do," he said.

"Spotify is a tech company, not a music company. They're not about breaking artists. To them a Joe Rogan podcast is the same kind of content as a new Rolling Stones single or a Sweet Spirit single. It doesn't matter to them and it's just content for their tech. They're about using their tech to make money for themselves."

For bluesy pop balladeer Nakia Reynoso, Spotify hasn't been a significant part of the promotion plan for the release of all three versions of the music from his new musical, Dueling Pianos, in large part because of his objections to how the platform uses its ownership deals with major label partners to create deals that result in poor compensation for musicians.

Acknowledging that "there's lots of people like Joe Rogan, and that's not going to change," Reynoso echoed Wommack in the hope that the scrutiny faced by Spotify and other streamers right now could lead to bigger change.

"The good thing about Neil and Joni and all the people from that protest generation is they've got the credibility to make this a story and just need other people to get behind them. At that point it would be something Spotify would have to pay some attention to, and they're already getting hammered over it. There's never been a better time than right now to say that this stuff isn't fair."